Episode #9 Sugar, Sugar, Sugar
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You are listening to wait a minute with Beth and Jessica episode nine
sugar in the morning Shogun, the evening she'll gets up. Do you know that song? Whenever I was thinking about preparing for this. I was like, oh gosh, is that a real song? Or do I just sing that in my head? I looked it up. It's like a real song. The whole song was so cute. It is catchy. And while the song was talking about love, the song really could be an ode to the actual sugar molecule, because we are obsessed with sugar.
We seem to be eating tons of it or avoiding it like the plague. We're obsessed with it. Baking at home. Watching baking shows, baked goods, sweets, and various treats are taking up massive amounts of space at the grocery store. Sweets are about the only thing that you can get at a coffee shop, food wise.
And we're also constantly talking about how we can reduce sugar, how we can replace it with other sugar, like complex. Even in diets that help you to not eat sugar. The main recipes that pop up and get the most viral hits are the desert hacks to still stay in compliance with diet rules. It is maddening.
Yeah. We are often texting each other about things we've seen in the world. And I recently saw this keto cupcake and a micro cup, and it was just like, what in the world is this? And it just shows how, when we make these really restrictive rules about foods, like sugar is just in our human nature to try to rebel against it in some way.
And this whole hacking thing is just not really solving any of the actual issues, but I did.
Let's talk a bit about sugar and sugar substitutes. today
Yeah. In researching for this topic, I came across an article about the history of sugar and the first line was to understand Western culture. You have to understand sugar.
Oof. If that doesn't sum it up right there. I don't know what does,
okay. Before we break this all down, can you give us a little history lesson about. Oh, my pleasure. I thought this was so fascinating. A little read about in depth sugar. Cause you know, like the most I had heard was that it was like super rare and only the rich people ate it and well, but other than that, it was just like, well, we went from rare salt to it being and literally every single thing we ate.
So I'm happy to share what they learned. And I can give you some links in the show notes. If you want to read more about it, it was in chunks and with pitchers. Okay. So before we had sugar granules, we had honey. So in Europe, Asia, and Africa, there was honey, but in the Americas, we only had syrups in fruit because bees are not native to the Americas.
They were imported here and the 1700. Which I also didn't know. So I thought that was really fascinating. So about 10,000 BC or so honeybees were domesticated if you will. So those hives were built closer to where people lived rather than finding them out in nature. So when they were more nomadic, they could find honey and things like that.
But as they became more agricultural in nature, they were able to put hives closer to where they were. And then at about 8,000. I see the sugar cane light plants are more like reeds were discovered a new Guinea, and it took about another 2000 years for them to be taken to India where it was first extracted and refined out of the reeds.
They were able to figure that part out. So India had the most grasp on getting it and extracting it for the longest. It's time. And then another few thousand years later. So now we're like in 80 times, the Greeks and Romans experienced sugar and India, and some of it was brought back to the Mediterranean region and traded to physicians for medicinal purposes.
All food is medicine, all food as medicine. So by 600 Ady sugar was discussed among medical scholars that met in Iran as a great Indian. Medical elixir. So it was here and I ran where the development further refinement into the actual granules. And so during this time of the , they really perfected growing refining and cooking with sugar.
So that treat that is almonds and sugar. Pan or something on that lines that came out of the time. Like they started developing that. It was like, but it was really only for the wealthiest classes. And they would at these very wealthy dinner events or things like that, it would be a sugar like sculpture.
It was very interesting. So it being reserved for the wealthy classes went on until about the 13 hundreds or so, but they were still considering. Medicinal all throughout. So as sugar eventually makes its way to the Americas. It still has like that medicinal note to it as well. So it took a long time for them to, it's almost like the world's earliest to marketing.
Right. Right. Right, right, right. And to know that wherever sugar harvesting was going on, slave labor was a part of it throughout the ARF time. And as it was discovered throughout the various Pacific islands and brought to the America, so it don't want to like sugar coat that, you know, it's been just like this magical thing.
There is. Not so great history going along with it then, like in the late 17 hundreds, they discovered that sugar beets could create a crystallized sugar granule. It got a lot of flack though, before it became popular, it took a long time. And then in the late 18 hundreds and the U S the manufacturers found a cheap way to maximize both beat sugar and sugar cane tomorrow.
Product. And also they monopolize the product and set the prices. So that was, I won't get into that. But finally in 1942, the American medical association said, whoa, whoa. The sugar is not medicinal. It's time to limit how much you consume. And in 1960, They were able to link sugar consumption to the rise in diabetes and other health conditions.
And so then that's where the interest in sugar substitute started. And during that time, I was like, when that was those first public health messages about sugar amounts are coming in and out. And then. Sugar, got a resurgence. When in the 1980s, fats became more villainized than sugar. So that started the low fat craze.
So there were saying, oh, this fat thing is actually what's causing all the problem, not the sugar. And we now know that that was also wrong. So then our first fake sugar was saccharin. It was invented in late 18 hundreds, but it was not popular at all. Except when we had to ration sugar during the world wars.
And once those were over, sugar became popular again, and saccharin was shunted to the diet products in the mid to early nineties, aspartame came out in the sixties and that was put all into diet sodas. Then heifer to a syrup, came out as a sugar alternative, then. Splenda in 1998. I actually really remember that coming out.
And then we got sugar alcohols. Remember those. And then Stevia has since come along and xylitol and everything out. So that's a very brief history. It's fascinating how it around the world, how it was used as scarcity, classism, slavery, all that used in the development of it becoming bigger and bigger production and then the industrialization of it.
So, yeah. Well, I remember even my mom talking about growing up because she's born in 1948 and how sugar was such a special thing. You know, they had maybe one cake in their home once a year. Oh, wow. So yeah, that's very different than my childhood where I felt like he lived up to her. Yeah. And then my in my teens was, yeah, the snack years, like the eighties and nineties.
So yeah. Okay. Well, it is fascinating to understand how it traveled around the world and how it was used, the scarcity and the classism. All of that is so interesting to me. So what do we know about sugar and its relationship to health? Like all things. It definitely seems complicated. So give us some. Of course it's complicated.
Right? So an IRA Aveda, they sometimes use honey as a way to deliver herbs to the body to fight off what is causing disease, like the sugars, the opener of the cells to get the medicine in a Trojan horse. If you will. I think it goes back to food as medicine. What is the dose? And in sugar's case, a little bit of it is just fine.
A lot of it, obviously not so much. Especially because now sugar, isn't just sugar. It's also with refined flowers and it's in so many things, even in things you wouldn't think it should be like pasta sauce. So I think it's just the issue of it's just too ubiquitous. And do I think that all pastries are bad?
No, but we've got pastries. We got coffee sugars. We've got frappuccinos in our pasta sauce. It's in everything it's in bread. So it was just kind of everywhere. And that's really the problem. So our natural sugars, like honey maple syrup, and that Gavi better for us then process sugar grains in some ways.
Yes, but not drastically. So for talking about dose, right? So again, it goes back to trying to hack the thing. Well, if it's natural, it must be good. You remember, like in culinary school, those desserts that we made with. How many dates do you think we consume any Dave brown, rice syrup and honey, and it's still a lot of sugar, right?
Like if you look at the nutrition facts that the glucose is still there. Right. But with those naturals, there's definitely some minerals that are found in syrup. Raw honey has other medicinal properties, you know, you haven't baked the bejesus out of it. So you're getting more of that. Artismal raw fish, Galvin.
Big question mark for me, supposedly it came out. I can't remember when this came out. I don't remember seeing it. I feel like it was in, oh, I remember. Cause I was working at central market and it was something that we sold so often because it was the Agava boom. And then it was the beer that, right? Yeah, it was new and it was also the beginning of the gluten-free boom.
So it was probably. 2010 that's when I remember seeing it roughly about that time. So if it was out before then, it was probably in known in smaller circles, but it was supposedly supposed to be low-glycemic because it has a much higher fructose concentration to glucose. So fructose is a single sugar molecule, so it was glucose.
So we have these mano sugars and we have disaccharides and like a big sugar. Right? So fructose and glucose are our main forms of. Sugars. So the thought was that we have a limited amount of fructose that our body can absorb compared to glucose, but it turns out that when they're mixed together. So having high concentrations of fructose with glucose, you actually end up absorbing.
More of both of them. And then also the thought was that fructose absorption doesn't have as much of an insulin response. So therefore like your glucose doesn't go up your insulin, doesn't go up. And then that also. Creates a change in your leptin response. So it would be better. But what actually is happening is that the signals for fullness from the insulin and leptin response gets off.
So you end up eating more overall food and calories because your hunger signals are confused. They also found that in animal models, higher fructose absorption got processed in the liver more quickly and got turned. More fats or weapons. Other animals studies found that high fructose amounts induced insulin resistance and altered glucose metabolism.
So it's not looking good. Um, but of course, I was able to find studies that showed that rats that consumed a Gavi over table sugar did not have as many negative effects on weight, blood sugar. And the research time, which, which I think was only like 10 to 12 weeks. So you can find the argument for both, but it's not looking so good.
Yeah. Well, and nobody really talks about Gabby anymore. I felt like it came and went and you can see it. I personally like to stick to honey or syrup because the processing overall is. There is some minute amount of other properties that are beneficial and with a Gavi, it's not really known how it impacts the body, but it's not looking so good for it.
I mean, the only way to really know is if you did your continuous glucose test with it, right. Okay. So what are sugar alternatives or sugar substitute? I mean, what are they? Sugar substitutes or sugar alternatives are natural or lab created molecules that have the sweetness of sugar. So that sweetness is anywhere from one time to 200 times sweeter than table sugar.
The other thing behind them is that they are substitutes because they supposedly do not have an impact on blood glucose levels. You say supposedly, but we'll get to that. So the natural ones would be things like Stevia, it's a plant, but then they process it. I used to grow it. I'm coloring in school. It tastes so sweet.
Even in that little green leaf, it looks like a mentally super sweet leaf because I processed that. And somehow they get that into the liquid, drops the powder, or combine it with any Yulin fiber to make it look like the sugar crystals. There's Monkfruit sugar alcohols, like , those are all the natural ones.
The lab ones are sucralose, which is Splenda. Aspartame, which is equal or NutraSweet saccharin sweetened low a soul theme, K, which is like sun net, or we've ever heard. I see them. Yeah. I don't really see those so much anymore. And then the research is literally all over the place about their impact positively or negatively on our health.
So anywhere from cancer causing to it's just great. Literally all over the place. So it's hard to say that's also a good example of just how health news comes to us. Right? It's like we can find both sides to things. And I feel like sometimes I get a client that's like, oh, I just read this article about this one thing.
And I'm like, well, what was your source? And like, can you find another call that shows the other side to it? Because it's like, this is why everyone's confused. And it's hard because I know how to look of research studies. But when. Google the things you don't get those first it's some random Quito blogger or just, or how much they pay to get.
Number one is unbelievable to me anyways. It's just like a lot of stuff that is not super helpful. Mandatory. The sugar alcohols in general. So a lot of them are fine in small amounts, but if you start on what it could potentially do, which we're about to talk about to your health is, is that if you have two months of them, they cause severe intestinal distress.
And so it gets posed bloating gas, and then some diarrhea. Who wants that because it's like, okay, so you're going to eat ice cream, that it has a bunch of sorbitol in it, but you don't have lactose intolerance. And the next thing you know, your stomach is about to blow up, right? You're like, oh, you'll be thin, but with raging diarrhea.
So enjoy that. Right. So I'm just like, that makes no sense, but, okay. So this goes to our next question, which is what do we actually know about the food sugars and how it affects weight? So diet drinks have been out for quite some time. Tab came out in the sixties. I've never had a tab. Have, you know, I've only seen the cans.
But it wasn't until diet Coke came out in the eighties that really put diet drinks on the maps. So that combination of Coke. Yeah. I think we all diet culture mix right in there. Anyway, they become super popular as a way to get that super sweet taste that people want that little bit of the caffeine that Coke's have and not having to.
But now research is showing that people that drink diet sodas versus real soda at meals actually eat more food at that setting or another that while glucose doesn't go up because there's no sugar being absorbed. For example, say you were to drink a diet Coke, no food involved, but you're just drinking diet Cokes because a lot of people do throughout the day.
Yes, your blood sugar might not technically go up, but the brain is perceiving that sweet taste on your tongue. And so insulin is going up because it thinks it has to deal with all of that. So it was, we we're getting a false insulin response. And so then we're getting all the downstream affects of that, which is a little bit more weight gain and insulin resistance and things like.
Yeah, this is just a great example that shows that calories are not the end all be all of how you manage your health and weight, you know, managing your blood sugar is key for all of us. Not just people who are diabetic. Yeah. So part of that continuation about how that diet Coke or those non calorie sweetened beverages.
So, what it does is we have that ends learner's response makes the blood sugars stay stored in those tissues. And then there might be some hypoglycemia that happens because then the glucose is not releasing now because it's like, the insulin is high. So it's like, oh, we can't release any more of this glucose.
And so then it's like, I'm hungry, you get the hunger signals. Right. And then we'll eat food. Right. So you actually have. Increasing the amount of food you eat. I know you don't have this number, but isn't there a link to obesity and diet sodas like a director. Yeah. Yeah. No, that, that's the length that they're finding.
Yeah. Yeah. Which is just it's mind boggling. And I'm sure it's frustrating for people out there who think that they're doing the right thing by not consuming extra calories, but really it's not. At all. So I've also heard that big sugars can make changes to your microbiome. And I know that gut health is all the rage, more people are learning about it.
And so is there any truth to that one? I've actually heard this as well. I believe it was specifically more related to sucralose. I personally have not looked up the research myself, so. I specifically say what's what, but I have heard that from good resources, but I can't verify that I've put my eyeballs on that research myself.
Okay. Just to appease the people. I know we have diet Coke fans out there. So what is the dose of diet Coke and really what is the dose of sugar, which is maybe a trick question, because I know the USDA dietary guidelines, which you mean take all that with a grain of salt, right? But they say 10 teaspoons a day about in sugar, which is about 42 grams of sugar, which would be like one real Coke.
Right. Which I think was also a newly lowered number, but I don't think they lowered it enough. Right. I read that the average American consumes about three times. The USDA suggested them out. So that's about almost 35 tablespoons or 142 grams of sugar and that's just sugar. So that's not even including all the other cars of all kinds that we're consuming on a daily basis.
So they're doing, yeah. I mean, The non-processed carbs. It's like really looking at the bigger picture. It's like, wow, it's just like a big number. And so that's why I think it's like, people think they're so successful keto because obviously going from like a total 300 grams of carbs to these like extremely low numbers, like 50 or 25, that's said.
When that we don't really typically recommend. Right. But anyway, I know the answer can vary, but where do you like to see clients can of land with the dose of we're talking about added sugars, let's start with diet Coke or real Coke. And I say the diet Coke piece, by the way, in Texas, it's either Coke or Dr.
Pepper. There's no other, there's no other. And so, whatever the thing is, I'm not calling out Coke as a brand talking about regional pop soda, whatever. Okay. So I say that diet Coke, because of that false response that your body has, right? So in a way you're making them equal, I'm making them equal because of the pho response of these beverages at most once a week.
But I would say as little as humanly possible once in a blue moon that a defining amount, I used to be a huge coat person. I had to wean myself off, man. That stuff is addicting somewhere in grad school, I was able to kick the habit I have like one or two weeks. Yeah, I think I have a few more than that, but we don't ever keep, so, I mean, we keep sparkling waters in the house, but no soda.
Yeah. So anyways, I know that a lot of people like to put sugar in their coffee or monk fruit in there and it's like, okay, how much are you doing? In the morning versus where else are you getting real and substitute sugar from throughout the day. But if I could wave my health wand and that I can just help people and the world, and we just live this happy, wonderful, balanced life was sugar.
I would say three to four teaspoons of added sugar a day, which I think is very generous, closer to like what 20 grams. Teen three times four is 12. So it's like every teaspoon is four grams of sugar. Okay. So like 12, not 20. Yeah. So it'd be like 12, which is still, I think it's fair. Reasonable. And our society.
It's like my almond butter, dark chocolate that I eat sometimes straight. And then there's a day or two where you have something bigger, like ice cream or dessert or a baked. Good. Right. So if we were to go back to that, to health benefits right there. Yeah. And we're just talking about added sugar. So this doesn't include other things.
No, I'm talking about fruit. I'm talking about added sugars and the things that we find in our sauces and we put in our coffee and our creamer. Yeah, cause it does add up and then like yogurt is one of those, another one I was going to say, holy cow, fruit on the bottom yogurt. It's intense. So that all that kind of stuff.
I think all the bars had several clients in the last few months that kind of observed. I was like, Observe what you're doing. Like where's your sugar coming from? Or they were people that said they didn't even eat sweet stuff or didn't have sugar. And then when they really kind of looked at it, they realized, oh, I'm drinking three sweet teas a day.
They were just taking away more sugar than they even realized, or yeah. Was in their coffee. And I'm like, Hey, you know what? That's great news because that's an easy adjustment. Yeah. I'm making similar adjustments with folks and working through that process of. Really loving sodas or sweet things and their coffees, those people are out there.
It's real. And again, it takes time. I mean, it took me a solid six plus months to wean myself off of a regular Coke habit. Well, do. And culinary school. I feel like all of our taste buds change to because totally, especially in the micro phase. Yeah. None of us were really eating any like added sugar except for the brown rice throughout the day.
And then when we went back, I feel like it was gonna be around Halloween. Like I did have a piece of candy and I was like, oh, this is so sweet. So it's like, but it does take time for your taste buds to change and yeah. All the effects that it has on your brain. Like the brain finds it so exciting. Right.
And so it's not easy. It's associated with joy, so many events of, of pleasure and joy and celebration and all of these things. So it is so ubiquitous in our everyday culture of, I feel sad, mad, or glad let's have some sugar. So. It's not easy to undo that, which is why I said, if I could wave my magic wand.
Right. Right. Well, you know, we do often have clients come to us saying, you know, Hey, I feel like I'm addicted to sugar or I just cannot stop these cravings. What do I do now? And I know that this one question will be its own podcast someday. I'm going to make note of that. But just for today, what is maybe one takeaway for how.
If they're feeling quote unquote out of control or sugar right now. Well, that's a story saying that I'm out of control, so let's look at the facts, right? So stop and look at your statement for. Let's take the drama out of the mama part of this. And then if you do feel like you are still, over-consuming get your facts rather than just making up, like, well, I just know, because you know, you're comparing or, you know, you're feeling something right.
And then come up with a plan of when. You have it and what you have, because then that takes the emotional brain out of the equation, because maybe those cravings are coming from an emotional response. Right. If I'm happy matter, glad then I should have something sweet. And so, but if we plan for it a little bit more and, or take the restriction out of it, then that might calm a lot of that down.
But then if there's still feels like, even though. It's like out of you, then maybe you have a yeast overgrowth that is driving all the sugar cravings, because I've seen that way more than one time where there was a yeast gut imbalances, and we cleared that up and then the sugar, the person still consumed it, but the intensity of the cravings.
The what and the, how much became it's more reasonable and not so intense. And like all I could think of. So the intensity of needing it and all of that was diminished. There's both of those. It could be the emotional side of it, where we're making this a really dramatic thing. And then obviously when you hate on yourself and you judge yourself, you're not going to be able to make.
Positive shift from that place. We have to take the drama out of it, like you said, and then it could be a truly physical thing where there's something going on inside of you that is driving this need because our bodies do send us messages of, Hey, there's something going on and I need. Let's alert ourselves of this system.
So like I said, that could have been its own podcast because there are even more answers to that question. But I just wanted to give the people a little something, something today. I was thinking we were talking about this last two points that I have a family member. They consume a lot of fake sugar.
Splenda things of that nature all day. And then I think about some of the health things that they're going through that are related to their hypoglycemia type events and things of that nature. And I'm like, okay, really? I wonder if. Two does work really hard too, because if she does accidentally eat too much real sugar or too much complex carbohydrates, she will have like a reactive hypoglycemic event.
And it's very scary. So now I'm wondering, well, her body might be thinking that these things are happening from real sugar, but it's not real sugar creating the hypoglycemic event. It goes back to this whole diet culture of thing of, it's almost not her fault. Somebody along the way told her, Hey, this is your alternatives.
Isn't going to harm you. And we just take kind of face value for some reason and run with it. But luckily there is more research when I see this person again and I talk about it. Like, I know what her response is going to be. And it's just like, well, I don't get to have anything else. Like this is new thing.
And I feel for her, but I also it's like, what's the amount here. Cause if this is, could be contributing to these. The serious things that are happening in your body that are sometimes cause hospitalizations because of the blood sugar imbalances, then it's like, okay, how much do we really want sweet things versus doing other stuff?
So it's just an interesting look at what could be really going on here. I don't know. Our addiction to the sweet taste. Yeah. We kind of touched on different podcasts with where's the line of your dose and your health. It can be challenging if your dose is so super low, it does go deeper than just don't eat sugar.
That requires actually probably some counseling at some level. I mean, I don't know. There's just so much language and diet culture, world of we can't demonize sugar. It's like, well, yeah, we're not demonizing it. And like we said, we're taking the drama out of it. We're just looking at some of these facts.
There are some facts about sugar and you can apply these to your body. If you are looking to improve or optimize your health, this is just something that we have to figure out, right. It's not, we're not trying to demonize it. It's just. That brings us to our weekly each week. We keep our eyes peeled out for things in the media or in real life that come from diet culture, or that perpetuated in some way, there are often subtle ways that seep in and we are shining a light on it and sharing it with you.
I'll tell you some good ones this week. I thought you did. I think my algorithm has,
yeah. The first one I sent you, is ice cream designed to be eaten before
ice cream? Yeah, I was trying to find the actual image. It is night food night, sleep friendly. Do you like sleep? That was the ad. So the canister says night food sleep friendly after dinner met chip, and then the tagline is, do you like sleep? So it says it has more a trip to van, more magnesium or calcium, more B6, casein protein.
Yes. Those things are great, great tastes, less sugar and fewer calories and no artificial. I actually kind of want to take. Because I hope that it tastes bad because I don't want it to catch on, uh, two-thirds of a cup still has 23. Grams of carbs, 10 grams of sugar, like who needs to be eating almost three teaspoons of sugar before they go to, to bed.
And if you go to the website, they're like we have a doctor on our team that helped us design this recipe. And this is also great for pregnant women. It's like, I eat a lot of ice cream when I was pregnant that I made myself. I didn't try to put less sugar into it because they didn't want to, all the shows afraid of gestational diabetes.
I was making a lower sugar ice cream for myself, but I think it's just the diet culture comes in because it's like, Hey, we're toting it as health food, but it's also just ice cream. Right. So if I compare it to. The hog and dos, then I'll ice cream. And I did this one because it's pretty basic and it is higher and fat than some of the others.
So in terms of like its sugar to fat ratio of it anyway, so we compare that. So if you do a half a cup of Haagen-Dazs ice cream versus two-thirds cup of night food, and that's the serving sizes would be about that. So then not means it's the same total carbohydrates. The difference is there's less fat in the night food and the protein is ever so slightly, like two grams more in the night food versus the Haagen dos.
So it's just a gimmick. Yeah, they did put in added calcium and added B6 0.4 milligrams. That's not going to do anything for sleep. And they put in 46 milligrams of magnesium also not going to do anything for sleep. So, yeah, it's a gamut gang and I'd be curious how. Like, what's the difference between like, if you just bought like a melatonin gummy?
I don't know. It's just frustrating. I just feel like I even personally have friends that would be like, wow, this looks awesome. You know? And so it's like, it's not like I'm not like hating on it. It's just, it's frustrating. I think when we take a. Fun food. And we tried to tote it as health food. I think that's where the misleading comes in.
It's not really doing us any favors. Okay. Next week. I can't wait to see what I come up with. Well, I sure hope that we gave him something new to think about today and helped you take one more step on your path to freeing yourself from diet culture. Be sure to subscribe to this podcast and follow us on Instagram at path underscore nutrition, and we'll see you next week.
Bye everyone.
